🎧Listen Now! Whitewater Bikerafting in New Zealand with Deane Parker

Podcast Intro Teaser

Lizzy Scully (00:00):

Tell us a little bit about how you got into bikerafting. My understanding is that you just did something super gnarly for your first time. But it seems like with your history, you’re uniquely positioned to be able to do that without really killing yourself like most of us would. So yeah, tell us about your first experience bikerafting. 

Deane Parker (00:20):

I had seen packraft when we were living in Hoka. Nathan Favre had brought, must have been real early in Alpacka days, a packraft over where he was looking to incorporate into his adventure racing. But I’d never paddled one. And so when Damian suggested this, I was all over it because it just involved combining bikes and boats. And I wanted to do more. So I added another river to the route that he was planning. And both of those rivers are Grade III (aka Class III). So we did one practice session on a flooded Bull River before we rode into a wilderness river and literally put on in the middle of a Class III rapid bike strapped on. And that was the first time, really. 

Lizzy Scully (01:09):

And how was that for you? 

Deane Parker (01:11):

It was great. It was fine because of this, so much anticipation and wonder of how the boats were going to react with the bikes on. I guess I was expecting it to be very difficult. But as you know, Lizzy, once you strap a bike to a boat and push off from shore, it gets real natural. After that, it doesn’t feel as clumsy as it looks. 

Podcast Transcription

Lizzy Scully (01:39):

Hello, my name is Lizzy Scully. And I’m the co-owner of Four Corners Guides and the co-author of The Bikeraft Guide with Steve Fassbinder, AKA Doom. We run a Multisport Adventure Guide service based out of the very small town of Mancos, Colorado, home of Alpacka Raft, the Mancos Brewing Company, and many other incredible small businesses. We live about a half hour outside of town at Scullbinder Ranch, our 35 acre base camp on the border of Mesa Verde National Park and the Ute Mountain Ute Tribal Park. 

Late in 2023, we started this podcast, a beginner’s guide to packrafting and bikerafting to bring you another learning channel for these activities. In this podcast, we’ll share helpful informational interviews with experienced athletes, guides, and others in the community, along with how-to episodes and storytelling. If you have any requests or questions, ping us at four Corners guides@gmail.com or comment on our social platforms Facebook or Instagram. 

Lizzy Scully (02:37):

And through the fall, we’ll be sharing stories, podcasts, videos, and photos focusing on international packrafting adventures. February, 2025, we’re heading over to New Zealand to partner with Huw Miles of packrafting Queenstown and Deane Parker of Deane Parker Adventure Channel on a specially curated adventure of that country’s finest rivers. 

So for #8, we are chatting with Deane Parker of Deane Parker Adventure Channel. Deane is one of the most renowned bikerafters in the world. He does very difficult whitewater trips on packrafts with bicycles, and he’s just a joy to talk to. So we hope you enjoy this next episode of, “A Beginner’s Guide to Packrafting & Bikerafting.” 

So Deane, I have known you for many years and I have interviewed you extensively for The Bikerat Guide and other things. And because those interviews are so garbled, I wanted to revisit some of the questions and some of your history. You are one of the most experienced whitewater bikerafters in the world, probably the most. And you’ve done the most exciting and, dare I say, dangerous remote adventures. As well, you have a unique place to do those things in being a Kiwi from New Zealand. 

So I wanted to revisit a bit about your history and background and how it set the stage for your current bikerafting endeavors as well as your guiding and bikeraft awareness building efforts. But let’s start with your history. Can you tell me just about your history with rafting in general? 

Deane Parker (04:20):

Okay. I left school and trained to be a fitness instructor in my early twenties. And when I was working as a fitness instructor, an old family friend who was a raft guide picked me up about coming on a couple of rafting trips. I instantly got hooked and maybe within a few weeks of doing river trips, I was guiding. This was in the mid nineties, so there were no qualifications or anything in New Zealand back then. So I just did a few trips and boom, I was a guide, mainly guiding inflatable kayaks back then. But that did that for a season. 

And then I decided I wanted to do this as a career. So I did an adventure tourism six month course and got a river rescue qualification and a first aid qualification and came across Don Allis, who was the owner of Ultimate Desense in New Zealand. He offered me a job. And I embarked on a seven-year rafting career in Murchison. And during that time, I became a partner in that business. And that business was unique because we did multi-day, heli rafting trips on the west coast. So we would fly in by helicopter because there was no road access and then raft out by the one- to three-day trips. 

Lizzy Scully (05:53):

Is that common in New Zealand? 

Deane Parker (05:56):

It was at that time because we had a massive fleet of secondhand cheap helicopters for deer recovery. And in the sixties and seventies we used helicopters to recover wild deer. And so this was kind of like the helicopter tourism boom was at the end of that deer culling phase in New Zealand. And we were flying into rivers for like 60 to 80 bucks into these remote pristine rivers. 

Yeah, so we built a rafting business around that. It was incredibly dangerous, using helicopters to fly around and to do rafting. We had many close calls and had a helicopter crash. I almost died three times in the space. But yeah, that was seven years in Murchison on the Buller River. And then Melissa and I, my wife and I set up a rafting business in Hoka on the west coast. That was where I basically discovered packrafting. Before packrafting, we were walking inflatable kayaks into the Hoka Gorge with clients, which is a stunning river. It has beautiful blue water and jungle rainforest. It’s a two-hour walk in with 18 kilogram inflatable kayaks. 

Deane Parker (07:28):

It was so painful. It’s probably why I’ve got such a bad back now. But yeah, that was a stunning location to run adventure tourism business. But it was, yeah, rafting on the west coast had a boom period and when I was there there was five or six rafting companies operating. And nowadays there’s one part-time rafting company because tourism just got very diluted with adventure activities. 

New Zealand innovated its way into all sorts of different products, including on rivers. There were river bugs and river sleds and river boarding. And so the rafting kind of became less popular because people were trying the next thing. And of course one of those next things was packrafting. But in the meantime, I left the rafting industry and embarked on a farming career. My wife’s family farm in Canterbury here. But during that time I was always adventuring, mainly bike packing. And then an opportunity came about. 

Lizzy Scully (08:38):

Wait, I have some other questions I want to ask you so I can, so that you just don’t talk the whole time because so I 

Deane Parker (08:46):

Do it.

Lizzy Scully (08:49):

I want to know what you liked about rafting, what it was that was appealing about rafting. 

Deane Parker (08:59):

I grew up in a family of hikers and bikers. And I’d always, even from when I was in my late teens, I’d been a mountain biker. So I loved the outdoors. The opportunity to go and be paid to work in the outdoors and to show people the pristine rivers that we have in the south island of New Zealand was an amazing opportunity. And the connections I made during that time, just like any raft guide, will attest to formed friendships that are still very strong today. So I loved rafting opportunity to take a group of people on a river and see them enjoy and be fascinated by the hydraulics and our rivers and swirls and being able to talk to them about nature. And it was a great time. Unfortunately, just like most other raft guides can attest to, it didn’t pay that well. So I think that was probably the reason why we moved on to farming. 

Lizzy Scully (10:12):

So now your history with riding bikes. So you started out as a mountain biker when you were a kid, is that right? 

Deane Parker (10:19):

Yeah, pretty much. 

Lizzy Scully (10:21):

How young were you? 

Deane Parker (10:23):

The first time I rode a mountain bike would’ve been like 16. So not real young. 

Lizzy Scully (10:29):

Did you race?

Deane Parker (10:29):

But they were pretty new in New Zealand then. That was like late eighties. Yeah, late eighties. And then I got into road cycling for a bit, shaved my legs for a while as you do. But yeah, and then during my rafting career, I’ve broke a leg three times. So biking has always been, we all know if you break a leg or biking is such an awesome way to build fitness without having the impact of running or walking. So biking just helped me recover from many injuries. Yeah. 

Lizzy Scully (11:08):

You broke your leg rafting. What did you fall out of? 

Deane Parker (11:13):

Oh, there’s lots of stories there. Compound fracture of my kneecap, whitewater rafting on the bull. And then another time I took a full bouldering on a river, on a shear wall on a river bank, held about four meters and smashed my heel. And then when we were living in Tika. I swam on the sticks river and oh, it was a crazy situation actually. I was whitewater kayaking and I went upside down and a stick went through my spray skirt into the cockpit of my boat and it held me there, it pinned me there. So I pulled Johnny and got out. But then I swam over the drop and just glanced my leg over a rock and broke my leg. I had to walk out from that. That was a bit of a eep. 

Lizzy Scully (11:59):

So you also were kayaking at the same time that you were whitewater rafting. 

Deane Parker (12:04):

Yeah. 

Lizzy Scully (12:05):

So tell me just a little bit more, were you boating Class V at the time? 

Deane Parker (12:11):

Yeah. 

Lizzy Scully (12:12):

Okay, so you were crazy.

Deane Parker (12:14):

Yeah. Well, and all of our class four and five whitewater rafting trips all had safety kayakers. So if I wasn’t rafting, I was safety kayaking. And we had a small team of guides and safety kayak is like three or four of us. 

Lizzy Scully (12:33):

So this is interesting. So now I’m going to jump back to biking. So you were a mountain biker. When did you get into the cross country component of cycling, like multi-day out and whatnot? 

Deane Parker (12:44):

Pretty much after. I didn’t really ride bikes during my commercial career. Only really to recover from the broken legs. But after we started farming, my outlet was mountain biking. So my very good friend Muel and I just basically started pushing the limits of doing hard backcountry riding. And that obviously was when bikepacking was becoming more common or trending. So yeah, we did lots of pretty decent five- to 10-day backcountry rides. 

Lizzy Scully (13:23):

So it seems like your hardcore adventures, I mean naturally led to your ability to dive straight into bikerafting really without trying something easy. First, tell us a little bit about how you got into bikerafting, because my understanding is that you just did something super gnarly for your first time, but it seems like with your history you’re uniquely positioned to be able to do that without really killing yourself. Most of us would. So yeah, tell us about your first experience bikerafting. 

Deane Parker (13:59):

I hadn’t done any boating for maybe for several years. And then a mountain biking friend suggested that we strap our bikes to these little boats and go down the Clarence River on the east coast to climb and ride off an unridden mountain called Dillon Cone. And I had seen packraft when we were living in ho Nathan Favre had brought, must have been real early in Alpacka days, a packraft over where he was looking to incorporate into his adventure racing. But I’d never paddled one. And so when Damian suggested this, I was all over it because it just involved combining bikes and boats. And I wanted to do more. So I added another river to the route that he was planning. And both of those rivers are grade or Class III. So we did one practice session on a flooded Bull River before that, before we rode into a wilderness river and literally put on in the middle of a Class III rapid bike strapped on. And that was the first time really. 

Lizzy Scully (15:13):

And how was that for you? 

Deane Parker (15:15):

It was great. It was fine of so much anticipation and wonder of how the boats were going to react with the bikes on. I guess I was expecting it to be very difficult. But as you know, Lizzy, once you strap a bike to a boat and push off from shore, it gets real natural after that. It doesn’t feel as clumsy as it looks. 

On the [river name?] it was pretty much continuous Grade III for about maybe several kilometers. We didn’t have a swim, we didn’t flip. We were being super careful. We were so buzzing after that because we’d been anticipating what it was going to be like for months before that. So we were pretty stoked. And then we rode out of that river and over into the Clarence River and met our cameraman and photographer. They then went bikerafting, both very inexperienced. Basically they had done very little boating. And they went bikerafting on the Clarence, portaging the Grade III sections. Or we paddled our boats through the Grade III while they walked around and shot that. But we ran out of time to do the whole trip, because I added another river to Damian’s route, we ran out of time to do the Dillon Cone thing. So that sat there for several years, as you know. 

Lizzy Scully (16:33):

How many trips have you done altogether now since I’ve met you. Because wasn’t it maybe when was it that we met through Alpacka? Was it like seven years ago? Eight years ago? 

Deane Parker (16:41):

I reckon that would’ve been like 2017. 

Lizzy Scully (16:45):

Okay. Yeah, so about seven years ago. And that’s when you contacted me when I was at the marketing person at Alpacka. That’s the first time you had gone bikerafting 

Deane Parker (16:55):

And packrafting.

Lizzy Scully (16:56):

And packrafting. Yeah. So can you tell me, I guess a little bit more about what inspired you to continue to push it and do bigger and more badass ventures besides the fact that you of course wanted to do Dillon Cone and finish that adventure out. What inspired you? 

Deane Parker (17:12):

Well, obviously there was a film made from that trip that was made by Simon Waterhouse who’s a professional filmmaker. He did a great job making that film, which was called Waiau-Toa Odyssey. While it did not go viral, it went around the place. And obviously it was quite unique because it was showed bikerafting in a challenging environment in Class III. 

And that’s when I picked up a camera. I’d always been into cameras, but never anything professional just in my rafting days. We used to take a camera and sell the photos to the clients. I studied photography at school, so I’d always had a background in photography and cameras. But after that first bikerafting trip, I decided that I wanted to film more adventures just because I was inspired by the feedback that we got from that trip. It was kind of a little bit addictive when you get that sort of accolades for something that you’ve done. 

Deane Parker (18:08):

I picked up a camera and started a YouTube channel and not really very focused on the social media side of things. I knew that I wanted the experience I had at New Zealand Mountain Film Festival with the Waiau-Toa Odyssey was a cool, so cool. Film festivals are the coolest experience for inspiring filmmakers to experience seeing our work being shown on a big screen. So my adventure filmmaking is made for film festival audiences and after that trip, Muel and I were so keen to find something more challenging. I dunno why. But anyway, so for the next couple of years we just played around with smaller trips, getting more experience what it felt like to paddle white water with a bike on a packraft. We recruited Rose Green as a team member and showed her the ropes with bikerafting and she had a little bit of experience with whitewater kayaking. 

Deane Parker (19:08):

She had a very steep learning curve because basically before we did the Fluid trails film. She had only really been bikerafting maybe a couple of weekends. And then on the Fluid Trails trip, which was our next evolution, we did almost 600 k loop that was over 200 kilometers of single track and three Class III rivers to loop it. We got so much good mountain biking with a packraft tied to our handlebars. And I was actually on a rigid fat bike as well, which was pretty challenging. But that was an awesome trip and I filmed most of that myself, which was the first time that I’d really made a film and edited it. Did the rounds of the film festival circuit in. 

Yeah, then I mean even back then, two years after the first bikerafting trip, I seriously could count on one hand the amount of times I’d been a packraft without a bike. Everything, every time I got on a packraft, it was bikerafting. It was quite unique to get on an unloaded packraft and paddle it. And I still really, even now, really enjoy packrafting whitewater because of probably that introduction to packrafting being so cumbersome with the bike. 

Lizzy Scully (20:26):

So do you actually get out and packraft a lot now when you have time when you’re not working? 

Deane Parker (20:32):

In the last few years, biking has become less of a motivator and packrafting has become more of a motivator. 

Lizzy Scully (20:40):

I’ve kind of seen that with a few different people, including my husband, Steve. I mean he still bikes a lot. But well, not so much actually the past few years. He just did this trip to the Northwest Territories and he just boated and a lot of his trips are just boating now. So what’s going on? 

Deane Parker (20:56):

My joints are getting older again, so the Biking’s not so I don’t know…. I’ve done a lot of the cool backcountry riding multiple times. My kids are 10, 14, 16. So when I ride a bike now it’s predominantly to get them out there. So yeah, biking just doesn’t motivate me as much anymore. 

But to be completely honest, Lizzy, it’s just as much about the brands that support me and the packrafting commercial community supporting me. And I support them and I’m driven by inspiration and that comes even from the businesses that I work with. And I don’t make adventure film for the money. I make them because I am passionate about it. So any business that can appreciate that and will support me, then I’ll support them a hundred percent back. And obviously that’s been Alpacka Raft for me and for seven years they’ve supported everything that I’ve put in front of them. And to be honest with you, pretty much Aqua Bound has as well. 

Lizzy Scully (22:13):

So it seems to me that you have three passions in life besides family and your farm, but that’s biking, packrafting and filmmaking. And you sort of melded your life together to make all three of those things happen in a really beautiful way. I’m curious if you have a sense of satisfaction more so than you had when you were younger. Or have things changed with the way you feel about your life because all of this has come together so nicely? You’re nodding. 

Deane Parker (22:42):

Yeah, I mean it’s really interesting because my main bread and butter is farming and that’s the other, I guess string to my bow. And I’ve melded my filmmaking into that as well. I’ve got a amazing job where I capture some of the most innovative farmers in New Zealand and am able to tell their stories as well. And at the same time, in an amazing synergy, I get to bring that innovation back to our own farm and incorporate that in our own farm system, which has been some sort of crazy symbiotic universal thing that I was not a passionate farmer before. I found filmmaking. And the filmmaking has allowed me to do that, to become more passionate about our land and soil and animals and people. And yeah, so I wear multiple hats. I don’t know how I manage to fit it all in and balance it all. Sometimes I don’t, sometimes I do. 

Deane Parker (23:35):

I would never give up my adventure filmmaking for anything because that’s what I’m most passionate about. That is my hobby now I guess. But yeah, it’s an amazing synergy. And now that I’m involved more in the community of the packrafting with both the packrafting Association of New Zealand and being invited to sit on the Safety and Safety Committee for American Packrafting Association  has been just cool because I really want to build awareness about packrafting. In New Zealand it’s still seen as an inflatable toy. And people are still getting themselves into trouble with them because there’s not the education there. 

Lizzy Scully (24:20):

So actually I have a specific question for you along those lines. What inspired you to start teaching other people and to make these educational videos? 

Deane Parker (24:38):

Yeah, I mean there were two drownings in New Zealand real close together a couple of years ago, one on a lake and one on a river. They were really stupid drownings. And that’s where it was for me. I realized that whilst New Zealanders had a really good reputation for being whitewater kayakers, some of the best in the world, this wasn’t getting transferred to the packrafting community. 

The packrafting community was mainly getting made up with hikers, fishermen, hunters, and the geography of New Zealand is the boldest driven creeks and rivers. And if you go into the headwaters, they’re near-on continuous. So a hunter that has no experience with whitewater thinking that they can take a packraft and float a deer out on a creek on the west coast, which pretty much most of them are Class IV & V blows my mind. And that’s pretty much where I started trawling the packrafting New Zealand Facebook pages to make sure that I could have a voice to warn people. It was crazy what people were doing. So that’s why I wanted to, that’s why I got into plans and why I have plans to produce safety and awareness videos both for PR and APA because I think that’s probably the best thing I can do to educate people is just as the same, bring those skills and packrafting and filmmaking and educate people. 

Lizzy Scully (26:13):

Can you talk to me a bit about how your students have reacted to learning to bikeraft? It’s just so unusual. So I’m curious what you think it does to enrich or change their lives? 

Deane Parker (26:27):

So maybe two years ago, Huw Miles and I collaborated to run a packrafting course and then subsequently I think I’ve run two workshops for PR bikerafting or maybe three. So it’s crazy, Lizzy, it’s crazy. People have no idea what to expect before they go bikerafting and it’s that it’s so clumsy, it’s so awkward… It’s so difficult to take a bike to pieces on a rocky river bank and imagine that you’re going to be able to strap that to a boat and then still paddle efficiently or effectively. And so the look of concern on people’s face while you’re assisting them load the bike to the boat to the smile they get a few minutes after they’re floating to realize, Hey, I’m not putting my life at risk by doing this. It’s cool. It’s great to see that. The people I don’t think of in the, I don’t know, 50 people or so that have been bikerafting with me, I don’t think anyone’s had an off-putting experience. I think it’s all primarily positive. I think people are going away thinking about how they can plan route to include bikerafting. So yeah, it’s cool. It’s amazing to have seen the uptake of bikerafting in that seven years that I’ve been involved in it. 

Lizzy Scully (27:52):

It’s still pretty niche though, wouldn’t you say? 

Deane Parker (27:55):

Oh, for sure. Absolutely. And it’s not for everyone. I think New Zealand’s not even necessarily the right landscape for bikerafting because we don’t have long distances to cover. I just imagine the limitless possibilities in North America and Canada and Alaska. And I can sense that if you had a fatbike and a packraft, you could go anywhere. And I mean that’s the beauty of bikerafting is you literally can traverse pretty much any landscape. 

Lizzy Scully (28:27):

Okay. So I wanted to ask you a few nitty gritty questions about bikerafting. And we’ve talked about this a few times because so many people are so fascinated with whitewater. And so I just want to reiterate by having a conversation about it, the dangers of bikerafting with minimal experience in whitewater and that people watch what you do and they’re like, oh my god, that looks so cool and so amazing. But you happen to have decades of experience. So talk to me about the dangers of bikerafting and whitewater, especially for people who are new to the sport, 

Deane Parker (29:01):

Rocky rivers. I think that’s the limiting factor for me in pushing the limits of bikerafting. It’s the danger you could place yourself in in a small rocks-driven stream, primarily to an expensive mountain bike ripping your derailier off or puncturing the packraft. But the worst possible scenario would be getting pinned against your bike. So there are some very real risks that need to be thought about when you are planning a route in the New Zealand landscape. We don’t have a lot of big volume rivers. And if I’ve known the characteristic, it’s pretty easy to say no if you know that it’s going to include scraping your bike off boulders and squeezing through narrow gaps. So primarily I’m trying to find something that’s got more width, more room. 

Deane Parker (30:05):

I mean the other real risk with bikerafting is the self rescue is more difficult and I think no one wants to flip a packraft with their $5,000 mountain bike on it. But really I guess if anyone wants to try bikerafting, that would be my advice is to chuck an old bike on it, go down to your local pond or lake and play around with what it feels like when the boat’s upside down with a bike on it and what it’s like to try and get back into it. Because obviously rescuing is incredibly more complex once you’ve got an upside down boat with a bike trailing along underneath. 

Lizzy Scully (30:46):

And I imagine it’s much harder for, I haven’t been in this scenario, but much harder to actually help someone else if you have a bike on your boat because it’s harder to navigate, especially if you’re in the middle of a Class III rapid, can I help someone in the middle of a Class III rapid? Probably, yeah, I think I’m good enough of a pack, but with a bike on my boat, nah, Uhuh not a chance. 

Deane Parker (31:07):

And there’s very few people that could Lizzy and that’s why Class III for bikerafting is by far and above the class five of bikerafting. It would be next to impossible to just help someone in the middle of a rapid Grade III, Class III rapid when you’re bikerafting on the fluid trails film. Rose fell out and we captured it pretty well and it was the first time that we’d done assisted rescue. I’ve never practiced it. It’s real life and actually when you look at the footage, it’s quite impressive how efficient it was. But yeah, same thing that comes back down to a team of three, two mills just has experienced RAF guide and kayaker is what I am. So we’ve got decades of experience. So I don’t think that the average person should be aspiring towards whitewater bikerafting, 

Lizzy Scully (32:01):

At least Class III because class two and class one are pretty, at least around here, they’re 

Deane Parker (32:05):

For sure build it up, progress, start on flat water, move to boot moving water, get a feel for it. 

Lizzy Scully (32:13):

Could you potentially share that footage with me? I’d love to see it and share it. 

Deane Parker (32:18):

Absolutely. Of Rose? Yeah, for sure. 

Lizzy Scully (32:21):

Who got the footage? You had the camera? 

Deane Parker (32:23):

That was Rose’s GoPro. 

Lizzy Scully (32:25):

Oh wow. Yeah, I’d love to see it. I mean I remember seeing a little bit, I think you had some clips of it in one of your films, but I don’t remember seeing the whole thing would be really educational I think. 

Deane Parker (32:36):

Yeah, I should definitely pull that out. Archives, that’s good motivation. 

Lizzy Scully (32:41):

That’d be awesome. So can you talk to me about, so it is challenging to get into bikerafting and one reason it’s probably still a pretty niche sport is because of all the different components, not just gear, but skills you need. Can you tell me about from your perspective the different kinds of gear you need and the different kinds of skills you need in bikerafting, packrafting, and other skills that you might need? What’s the breadth of this to get into bike 

Deane Parker (33:09):

Bikerafting? Yeah, well I mean bikepacking’s a really essential skill because you need to be able to have basically an incredibly heavy touring load on a bike. So if you’re not comfortable riding with a heavy load in difficult terrain, bikerafting is not going to be for you. So you need good bike packing skills. Obviously if you’re talking about white water, you need to have had some previous white water skills. The loading of the bike on the packraft and conversely loading the packraft on the bike is something that you want to have practiced. And as you know, making sure that you can paddle effectively with a bike, you’ve got a good range of movement with your paddle is really essential. I think the other things, if you’re doing multi-day trips, you have to be so good at ultra light hiking or bike packing because you can’t take everything. 

Deane Parker (34:07):

The gear that you take needs to double the raincoat needs to be a paddle jacket, for example, if you try, I’m not too sure how many people take dry suits bikerafting, but it’s just something that I can imagine would be another cumbersome element that would not make the riding a lot less enjoyable. So for my kit for bikerafting, even in the cold is a one and a half millimeter neoprene pair of long pants and splash pants or over trousers over top of those. And then very warm either fleece or merino layers and maren coat. That way those that clothing can dual purpose and logistics, I mean if you are the sort of person who likes planning transitions, maybe if you come from adventure racing background or you just like the challenge of jigsaw puzzles, you’ll bikerafting will be for you because it is a bit of a jigsaw puzzle. 

Lizzy Scully (35:09):

Interesting. So jigsaw puzzle as far as putting the roots together, as far as putting the gear together, as far as the transitions, the whole package 

Deane Parker (35:16):

For sure, isn’t it? 

Lizzy Scully (35:18):

Yeah, I never thought about it that way, but yeah, totally. What are some of the most common questions people have asked you in your courses or in general at the films about bikerafting? I know with rock climbing, if you’re doing big walls, people always ask how do you shit off the wall? What are the common bikerafting questions that you get 

Deane Parker (35:40):

A lot of people, I mean if you are not a packrafter, people cannot get over the idea that you can put your gear inside the boat. I mean it seems so just normal for us if we’re packrafters, but for the general public, that doesn’t really make sense or everyone wants to know how often you punch the boat with a bike. Everyone just assumes that because you’ve got sharp chain rings and cassettes and pedals that the bike’s going to be at big risk from punch. Have you ever had a bike punch for a packraft and bikerafting? 

Lizzy Scully (36:13):

I’m super lazy and I don’t even take my pedals off. I just cover the bottom pedals off. 

Deane Parker (36:19):

So that’s a pretty common question and people can’t understand how you can carry a boat on a bike if you come across hikers on a trail. They’re like, where’s your boat? And because people just don’t understand how compact and small you can get a packraft. I guess those are pretty much the most common ones. 

Lizzy Scully (36:40):

What about common questions from people who are learning or even people who have experience but they’re just trying to get better and they’re looking to you for information? 

Deane Parker (36:49):

A lot of people want advice and tips about how to tie the bike to the boat. A lot of people want advice as what I was just talking before is what we wear. I guess the thing that’s the most challenging for people when you get into the boat is the range of movement of paddling. I’ve never come across a loading technique where I’ve got full range of movement for paddling. You are always compromising a little bit. So that gets people a bit. 

Lizzy Scully (37:24):

Thanks. So is there anything that I’m not asking you that you want to share with me about bikerafting, New Zealand packrafting or anything that we talked about today? Anything I’m missing? 

Deane Parker (37:36):

Yeah, I mean I guess even in New Zealand, the potential for packrafting still, there’s still a lot of exploration to do and that’s the cool thing about both bikerafting and packrafting is being able to look at the map with a different lens. Yeah, I’m really looking forward to going back to the West Coast and packrafting some of the old horns, albeit probably lower stretches and not the headwaters. Yeah, I mean the West coast or the South Islands really only seen a handful of packrafters, so it’s exciting. It’s adding another level of exploration to adventuring and that’s I guess some of the appeal for a lot of people about adventuring is the exploration factor. And I’m really positive about the packrafting community going forward. It’s an activity that draws quirky individuals and you’ve seen it in the wide diverse range of people that it appeals to. I love, I love it. 

Lizzy Scully (38:41) 🤣:

You calling me weird? 

Deane Parker (38:47):

Not everyone’s weird and weird in a good way for sure. A weird in that we are open, we are open-minded to new things. I mean, if you’re not open-minded, you probably won’t try packrafting. You’ll get in a plastic coffin and do a whitewater course and follow the sheep. But yeah, I think packrafting is kind of stepping off that traditional path of river travel and it appeals to people that that are looking for something more unique or a different way. I mean, I know even with Four Rivers, you guys have really have come up with some unique routes to access places that are not seen by a lot of people, and that’s what makes it so amazing is that it just takes you to places that people can’t go necessarily. 

Lizzy Scully (39:41):

How about we give a shameless plug to the trip that you and Hugh Miles and four Corners guides are running next February? 

Deane Parker (39:52):

Yeah, so I mean, it’s a super exciting opportunity to go on a multi-day tour in New Zealand with a group of pet crafters and especially the itinerary that Hughes planned the shot over and the Landsborough Rivers are pretty much two of the most iconic rivers in the South Island. So all going well with a tour can capture both of those multi-day trips and an 11 day tour, you’re going to get to see an amazing glimpse, the rivers of New Zealand, and both get to see that unique aspect of how we travel to rivers with fixed wing or helicopter. We still have that ability to access remote rivers and also the lands were, and the shut over are quite uniquely different rivers, different natures, and Hughes an amazing operator and he knows the central Otago and Southern West coast area like the back of his hand, so I’m sure that he’ll put on an amazing tour. 

Lizzy Scully (40:57):

Cool. Thank you. All right, well, I think that’s all I’ve got. I really appreciate you taking the time to chat with me and playing phone tag for the last two months, so thank 

Deane Parker (41:11):

You. No worries. 

Lizzy Scully (41:12):

Always. Thank you, Deane. It’s always a pleasure to chat with you. 

Deane Parker (41:15):

Same Lizzy. 

Lizzy Scully (41:17):

Well, I hope that I get to go next year with you guys. This chances are slim, but if we can fill the course, then I’m going to go. 

Deane Parker (41:23):

Yeah, well, I hope you both can come. That would be super special to actually physically be able to give you both a hug and thank you for your support and collaboration over the years. So I hope that does happen. 

Lizzy Scully (41:36):

Me too. All right, cool. We’ll, have a wonderful day on. Wait, is it winter there now? Are you not working on a farm? 

Deane Parker (41:43):

Yeah, winter. 

Lizzy Scully (41:44):

Okay. It’s like 95 degrees here. I don’t know what that is. What 

Deane Parker (41:50):

It must be like mid thirties, which is hot.  

Lizzy Scully (41:55):

Very, very, very hot. 

Deane Parker (41:59):

Yeah, we never get mid thirties. I mean, in summer for us, mid twenties is, or maybe high twenties on occasional day. 

Lizzy Scully (42:07):

Yeah, it’s really hot, but luckily there’s a river on the property, so I can just go dunk my head anytime. 

Deane Parker (42:11):

Nice. 

Lizzy Scully (42:12):

Well, have a wonderful day and I will 

Deane Parker (42:15):

Yeah, you too, Lizzy. Great talking with you. See you later. 

Lizzy Scully (42:20):

Thanks so much for joining us for the Beginner’s Guide to packrafting and bikerafting podcast. If you’d like to follow us, you can do so on Podbean or Spotify. You can also find the show notes on the four corners guides.com blog and on the podcast page. If you have any questions, comments or suggestions, please email us at FourCorners guides@gmail.com. Thanks so much for listening.